EDIT: I'M A DUMBASS THAT'S SO HYPED UP ON COFFEE I FORGOT A LOT OF IMPORTANT THINGS I WANTED TO SAY SO IF YOU WANT REREAD OR SOMETHING PLS DO AAAA
I spent some time reading the first half of this thread and skimmed through the other half because I was getting impatient.
I don't usually bother spouting my opinion often, but I guess if it's for the benefit of a site I frequent often for a reason that isn't mentioned in this tread, I may as well spout something to contribute or w/e.
I'm not going to pretend to know everything and anything about the history of this website, I haven't done research prior, so these are all observations, so everything I'm going to say I know for a fact I'm not sure if they're right or not. They're just what I think is right by my own logic.
First off, I'm not certain where this misconception that "There are no admins/leaders! That's why TSC is dead!" came from.
I'm sure I saw someone mention this, but keeping a community active isn't the job of those keeping order. Having more admins changes nothing because giving the option to kick/ban people to active members in this community will NOT change a thing. Being an admin doesn't mean anything besides that you're the authority and it's not their job to keep their community active. That's the community's job.
For instance, if I was an old admin in this site, and I see that the community either is dead without me, or isn't doing anything without my consent, of course I'd get bored of coming here. They're forcing responsibility of their actions on me, that isn't fun.
Being a community means that everyone has their job, their responsibility to keep activeness and sustainability. If the community itself can't be self-sustained, there's little incentive for anyone to change that. I mean, look at what's happening here. Besides this niche group of members, there's only a lot of talk of "change" without actually doing anything besides noting the flaws, and then there's the group who stopped caring, for the sole reason that the niche group is thinking but NOT acting, and that's just boring to watch. It's the same group of people at the same issue again, what else has changed? They're fully aware of what's going on here themselves, so why should I be here? I don't compete anymore, and the niche group is keeping themselves sustained, so there's little need for authority here especially when everyone pretty much understands each other on a personal level. I mean, having a leader to direct someone is fine, and is pretty essential to something like a group effort, but without the group, the leader has nothing to fall back on.
You may be thinking, "Fiva! FF's solo organization on the marathon is proof that we need more admins!"
Which I respond to: Her being an admin has nothing to do with her "administrating" the marathon. She may have more authority over most users, but users have every ability and right to come together to help out. Admins aren't the only people that make things happen, they have and always should be "advocators" or "speakers". They are the businessmen of the group organization, THEY are the good people that represents the good and the passionate about said organization, but the organization in it's entirety should be the one responsible for making it happen, not just the head honchos. This isn't to say something like this didn't happen, but as a community, we should organize this event together despite it only really concerning a group of members that are sociable and active that require it to properly function. AND besides, the point is to have an activity to get the entirety community together, whether they're participating by being a main part of it, or supporting it by being there. Activities that brings every faction of the community together by participating in their own way.
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Branching off this "admins" point, I'd like to ask, what's the main purpose of this website? What has been and still is the main intent and the main area where activity has been consistent?
The competition I would think, right?
As a "horrible member of the post 2012 TSC community", the forums are NOT a part of my priority when coming to this site. By experience, the only time I came here is to introduce myself before I dedicate myself to the competition so the community that is more sociable can be aware that I just didn't come from nowhere. (despite actually asking a few questions, but nothing else beyond that)
But I would like to ask; What exactly is the point of having a forums in the first place?
In a website that focuses on competition (by advertisement), interactions should just be an added factor that contributes to the integrity of the website as a whole. It's not a necessary thing because I'm here to show off.
Subjectively, a lot of people could disagree with me on this, but the way TSC is advertised to the public (like how I was personally introduced to it) says otherwise. I came here to compete.
This is a good factor I'll discuss in detail later, on how since this exists in this community, there's a large dissonance between members that's been around for a while vs newcomers just grasping the idea of this website's intentions.
Anyway, why is all I mentioned above a problem?
Well, it's just like I said. What's the point of forums? Why should I bother coming here? I'm competing often, providing proof, and getting incredible stats. In the face of the community, I don't need to be bothered with despite my good times, because of proof I provide.
And that's good for me! I'm not that sociable of a person (despite me wanting to be), people are aware of my existence and my skill, and that's all I need in order to feel justified and satisfied with my current place in the competitive community. I feel a thrill when I see my name so high up in the ranks, I just want to see more of that! The lust for competition is thrilling, just seeing a record I set just to be beaten by a few frames? AMAZING! A constant back and forth like a battle of the gods, as those below just watch in splendor. It's like an intense game of hot potato.
But despite all that, point is everyone isn't like me. When people come here, they come to learn about their Sonic speedgame so they can get the thrill of competition. For instance, I learned how to speedrun by observing other's runs and applying it to my own run.
Now, while you think that's easy to do by concept, A LOT of people lack the thorough understanding or the reflexive ability to pull off a 1:1 replica of the WR time.
And although I sound like I'm on a high horse, you may ask why do I even bring this up?
Well, let's take into consideration our lovely competitive side. A lot of people that I never even heard of that aren't part of the sociable niche I came to recognize on this website provide stats here on a near daily basis.
Most of these people are just like me. They came here for the competition, and want to take part to see how they rank in terms of skill. It's why I came, and it's most likely why others have come here as well.
Now, I bring the point that they aren't like me not as a way to inflate my ego, but most people can't speedrun at the same level of skill as I do simply by just observation by others runs. If that were the case, being sociable is OUTRIGHT POINTLESS and everyone's times here would be WR or at the very least very close to it. Observation is just a key factor into understanding speedrunning but I'm sure you're all aware of that. But if that's the case, then why is it the only thing most people rely on?
And this is important to note because thinking about it, there IS an active community at the competitive side of things, but they aren't sociable, and because of that, they lack in the thorough understanding of the game they're speedrunning despite their best efforts into seeing what the top dogs do.
I know this is a generalization but speaking in these terms help smooth out my point: The newbies that are attracted here don't try to approach the elitists. (i honestly can't think of better words right now so bear with me, there is no hidden message behind the way i worded things here)
As a newbie, I came here because I personally used to speedrun Sonic games for fun right? SO IN TURN, I just show up, submit stats, and call it a day because after all, the main reason I came to this competition website is to see where I lie in a competitive level compared to others who are competing in the same.
But because of this, I don't see a reason to go to the forums. I don't feel like going to those who know what they're doing, because I already have access to their videos. I don't need to ask anything if everything I need to know is there, right?
And that's where the problem lies.
This community isn't dead because the niche group isn't trying hard enough, it's because the newcomers aren't taking advantage of what they have at their disposal by knowledge standards. Sure, logically it's more useful to ASK and PARTICIPATE in the expansion of their speedgame, but it requires much more effort than to just depend on a video and call it a day.
There's nothing in this website that can provide me any incentive to go visit the forums at all. Because if I REALLY wanted to know how the speedrunners did exactly what they did in their video, I'd discuss it with them directly by PM, by their social media site, or by e-mail.
Doing something as obtuse as creating a thread seems utterly pointless and would require too much effort unless the person I see the speedrun in question isn't active on YouTube anymore.
Now, at the same time, this idea can be a double-edged sword.
We can blame the laziness of the newbies all we want, but it's also the fault of the elitists for not attempting to reach out to the newbies and help them out when they first enter this domain, diversify themselves in this little slice of this world of competition, and get a thorough understanding of it. This may sound like the newbies should be entitled to not take any action and wait for elitists to do everything for them, but no, both parties aren't taking action to change anything.
The elitists are staying in their niche group unless a newbie goes to pursue them which of course they'd gladly accept and help out due to their eagerness, BUT the newbies are staying by themselves despite the elitist's existence because doing so requires more time and effort into accomplishing what they want from here, which is to better their skill. So why waste time on a forum if I can talk to the runners directly?
Doesn't that seem a bit opposite?
Shouldn't the elitists, desperate for more members and activities, for more social interactions and expansions to the website that they love so dear try to attract the newbies as much as possible? Get more people to compete so we can have a consecutive understanding of the essence of competition? Pursue sonicgamemaster230485723 and tell them "Hey, I noticed your stat the other day. Looks like you understand the fundamentals but lack the proper deeper understanding. Maybe if you want, I can help you out there buddy, you'll get a better time for sure with our help~!"
After all, I'd like to be good at a game I enjoy speedrunning. I'd like to get a better time and show off my skills to these guys, right? That's why I'm here, isn't it? I'm here to share my skill and competition with this community, if I wasn't, then why bother coming?
At the same time, as a newbie, it should be my responsibility to seek for help when I need it. The forums are here right? If the world record holders are accounted for in this website, of course I'd look for them here, it simply makes sense right? There's a chatroom if I want an instantaneous answer. People should have social media links if I prefer that. Accessibility is fairly diverse in this website, so it isn't hard to get in contact with somebody.
Why is this not the case?
"But Fiva!" you beckon, "I have a TSC link in my stream bio to attract more users! Shouldn't that be enough?"
Well, you attract people here, but what should the newbies instinctively do next? There's nothing here to direct them besides the "Site Info", and when they get a thorough understanding of the fundamentals of this website, then where else do they really need to go from there? Nowhere right? Besides the submissions being the main aspect of why people would and could come here, there's nothing else convincing them to go anywhere else. In my experiences, I'd look for the world-record time here, see how they did it, and attempt it myself. There's a forum here, but is there something they can provide here for me if I'm not that sociable? Or not that investigative? Of course not! I already know how to execute what I came here to do, so there's no need for the extra stuff. After all, they are extra, right?
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All this ties together as to where this "admin" misconception may have came from. The elitists don't need to know stuff they're already aware of, and the newbies don't need the elitists to tell them when they have other ways of learning what they want, in addition to what they want to learn is laid out to them in a simplistic manner. SO, instead of considering "MORE ADMINS!", consider that because of this behavior is possibly the reason as to WHY there are so many inactive admins in the first place?
WHAT REASON OR INCENTIVE DO THEY HAVE TO BE HERE IN THE FIRST PLACE!?
Honestly, what's going on here is that there are two VERY CLEAR factions of people that exist within this website.
And neither party are concerned with their own affairs without considering the fault of their own, or affiliating with the other party. (at least, that's how I interpret it)
Nobody from the elitist is making it a priority to make this website have an incentive for newcomers to be part of their community. Why should I? I'm only here for competition afterall.
And because of this newbies are neglecting the heart of competition by not interacting with their frienemies, getting to expand their knowledge, because they don't see a reason to. Nothing flashy or interesting besides a sociable dedicated group of people is attracting them to do so. That's what creates this dissonance.
For example, if I wasn't capable of learning the games I speedrun by myself, nobody here would even know who I was, or care about my stats. I'm barely sociable with anyone (besides Joshua) despite knowing everybody in the niche group. Yet, people still know me, and I barely talk to them. Why is it this way?
Anyway, if that were to change, incentive for the nonsocial people would exist, they'd be active with everyone as a whole because there'd be reason to beyond just "learning stuff for muh game" It wouldn't just feel like a ONE THING deal with those who know what they're doing. They can approach people as people, not as alleged top dogs, they'd have more relation with them and will be more willing to speak with them beyond the "business talk" for strats and such. And those that are sociable and have more experience would have less reason to get bored of seeing the same people. Get to experience more generations of TSC members and continue to push it beyond what it already is. A feeling to experience actual GROWTH as a community and as a knowledgeable group of friends. It'd be an ACTUAL COMMUNITY instead of a CLUB WANTING TO BE ONE.
And before you think it, no, I'm not basing this off what I want from TSC. I already have everything I want from here, I don't need elitists to come for me because despite my non-social approach, I'm still sociable when people interact with me. I'm mostly basing this on what I see, and all I ever see are the niche group, which is the Race Night group. I barely see anyone from MHC take any interaction here with.. ANYTHING besides DsS, and I always forget that the IRC group even exists.
I'm sure that if there weren't factions like this (and no, I don't mean factions from within a faction like the differences between the participation between MHC and Race Night members) things would be a lot better. Maybe adding more modern social media can help, but despite that it isn't effecting the current state of the website as a whole.
People come here for stats, for competition. If something like Twitter would be integrated, the forums don't need to exist, and people have even less reasons to use this website for anything else besides just submitting times. It'd be more neglected than it is now because social media outlets, well, obsolete any need or use to coming here at ALL. We're trying to attract members, not distance them more right?
If any of that made any sense, then good I guess. This is just a big ramble of thoughts I literally came up with this off the top of my head today so I don't have any means of knowing ways to better this place or a clear concise explanation of what exactly I'm trying to portray here. (lolcoffee)
Sorry if I sounded mean or anything, there is no ill intent behind everything I said, it's just my thoughts on what I interpreted from the matter.
