[Cream147]

We have about 100 goals. The fact is there is no specific code in SRL bingo v5 that prevents same goals popping up. I will attempt to add this at some point.

[Keith]

1) The rules are more common sense, and are supposed to be fully comprehended before actual play. Also note that there are bingos that exceed 20 rules and are not overly complicated.

2) Short and long are by no means perfect at this point, they will get better as goals are added.

3) I concede that this bingo was launched prematurely, but this was only for testing purposes and the general reaction of people to determine whether work should be continued on it.

4) More importantly no one who is working on this bingo has ever scripted or created a bingo before, therefore perfection is not to be expected. The goal is to have fun :)

[Bilan]

>exceeds 20 rules
>not overly complicated

[Cream147]

>exceeds 20 rules
>not overly complicated

I personally disagree with your implied point

[TimpZ]

I must say that I personally think bingo for sonic games is a bad idea and I probably won't be playing them much, if at all, at least until it has matured a lot. But if you find something new, fun and interesting then good for you.

Thorn, There's nothing wrong with the same goal appearing multiple times on the same card, that's an intended basic mechanic of the bingo. It does however prevent it from being the same goal multiple times in a single row/column/diagonal.

But until you get a system that allows you to specify which 3 games that cards are getting generated for or at least limit the card generated to a certain set of games (since it otherwise gives a huge unfair advantage due to actually owning them and/or being able to play them) and do a lot of balancing (as is always needed for new bingo's) I don't think there should be a TSC race incorporating them.


About having a lof of rules, there's nothing wrong with that but making a global rule that only applies for one or a few games is stupid. Do it right and do it like this.



EDIT: Alright so I thought about it a bit and the reasons I think pure Bingo aren't going to be good for racing are basically:

1. There's no real routing other than identifying goals you know can do quickly in succession, perhaps with exception to special cases.
2. Multiple games on multiple consoles
3. Sonic games aren't open ended at all. You beat one level, you go to the next and beat that.

Something I think might be interesting though is a goal generator that gives that a bit of that bingo feel. However you can't do this for multiple games in a lot of cases since they're not similar enough. I did this with S3&K since that's the game I know best myself and here's what I'm imagining:



Before you ask, no I didn't even try to balance it. It might be possible to do this in a crossover with Sonic 2. Something I like about this idea is that it allows for the racer to pick their character of choice.

Obviously a lot of balancing would have to be made and more kinds of restrictions/criteria's be thought up. Perhaps even more categories to make anything but "Act" to be more like a real bingo.


So yea that's just my thought on it. Of course any further comments about this idea or bingo in general should be posted in a separate thread but I'm posting it here as part of my argument.

[Cream147]

The race happened, by the way. 10 racers, not bad for a Tuesday night on a day's notice. Hope everyone enjoyed racing, and all critique on the bingo has been noted and will be considered and hopefully dealt with. If anyone else has anything to add then please do tell me, because I'm really keen to get this idea working as best as it could.

With regards to TimpZ's comments, I will first say that yes, the more games you own, the better, as it gives you more choices. However, if the goals were perfectly balanced (which they never will be, but we'll go for as balanced as we can) then in theory there would actually be no advantage, as as long as you could complete a single row all rows would be balanced. What I'm saying is the more balanced I make the goals, the less having more games is going to be an advantage.

I do agree that offering an option to select the games the card picks from is a good idea, but right now we're some way away from being able to offer it. This is in my future plans.

I'll also respond to your numbered points:

1) The routing is choosing which games to play, as many goals are open to multiple games. There's also figuring out in what way you're going to best achieve the goal. And of course choosing the row itself requires thought. I've made route adjustments on the fly in the last two Sonic bingos I've played, by doing all sorts of calculations while playing. It just adds a new element to simply playing through the games.

2) I agree that this is a shame, you have to sort of make do the best you can.

3) They're as open-ended as the goals allow them to be. A large part of the open-endedness in the bingo comes from choosing the games you wish to use, and planning your route accordingly.

Most importantly, a Happy 9th Birthday to TSC, and here's to many more years of being the best competitive Sonic resource on the net!

[flying fox]

I was going to make a post about what happened with the race but I have been busy doing other stuff and working on the race nights rotation, which should be finished very soon.

As for bingo, what I would like to do is wait till you guys have properly sorted it out, then race it again. I will then bring it up in the games to race discussions topic and see if people are interested in adding it to the list.

[Thorn]

Thorn, There's nothing wrong with the same goal appearing multiple times on the same card, that's an intended basic mechanic of the bingo. It does however prevent it from being the same goal multiple times in a single row/column/diagonal.

The card I linked does have a goal twice in one row. If twice NOT in a row, column, or diagonal is okay, that's fine; however, is that you saying it, or Cream147 and Keith? They responded as if it was a problem.

[TimpZ]

Cosmo's bingo generator doesn't do an error like that so Cream must've altered the code in some way.

[Cream147]

Cosmo's bingo generator doesn't do an error like that so Cream must've altered the code in some way.

Wrong. Cosmo's code DOES do that if that is synergistically the best option, which right now it occasionally is.

And Thorn, it's not a problem if the same goal appears in different rows and columns in other bingos, but I'd rather they didn't in this one becaue otherwise one game might get a monopoly on the board.

[TimpZ]

Wrong. Cosmo's code DOES do that if that is synergistically the best option, which right now it occasionally is.

All I can say is that a bingo card with the same goal in the same row/column/diagonal since v2 or v3 is unheard of. I haven't looked at the code myself but the way you describe it it might be because of the way you're adding goals, i.e. a code altering on your part.

[Cream147]

It's because the goals right now have a lot of synergy. On most bingos the grid generally won't have a single synergy point. With no synergy it is impossible for a duplicate to come up in the same row, because that has synergy, and the code will always try and go for the lowest synergy. In the Sonic grids, because of the way I have categorised things, there are lots of synergy points, meaning that there is a possibility of duplicates in the same row (on long and short cards only). The way to combat this will be to add more goals, which is what we are in the process of doing.