[SpinDashMaster]

I've had this idea for quite some time, but I want to take things a step further and share my idea -- especially since S4E2 promotes and ranks the concept now.

I'd like to begin a subsite of TSC called the Co-Op center, a competition chart list focusing on two players playing in each of the games' inherent Co-Op modes.

Here's some facts that would apply:

Creation hurdles -- Nothing new would need to be coded into the charts. When two people obtain a stat, they submit it to the site under their respective usernames (or just yourself if you got the stat with a non-member).

How it affects Sitewide -- It won't. Since everything would be tracked on a separate subsite, no changes will need to be made to the main TSC competition rules.

Old Stats -- in games where Co-Op and single player mode are not separated (e.g. Sonic 2/ Sonic 3), players may submit stats obtained in single player mode, but only from the same character as the one who takes the lead role in Co-Op (e.g. Sonic's stats in S+T charts in S2 is OK, but Tails' stats are not.). This would help create a benchmark for comparing single player stats against Co-Op stats.

Labor required -- after the subsite is made, I can handle basically everything else on my own (I've pretty much mastered chartmaking now that I did S4E2) and I already know how to create forums and competition rules and such.

Also for reference, the following games would be included:

Sonic 2
Sonic 3
Sonic & Knuckles
Knuckles Chaotix
Sonic Adventure
Sonic Advance 3
Sonic the Hedgehog (2006)
Sonic Colors
Sonic 4: Episode II

So, what do you think? Want to embark on a new adventure with your friends? Post your approval or disapproval below and don't forget to vote.

[arcfx1985]

I'd say with the release of Sonic 4 Episode 2 that this could have some initial popularity, but would it have staying power? I'd love to be able to pair up with someone for some Sonic 2/3&K runs as well (I believe emus support netplay, or I could just control Tails with my foot). It'd be a nice place to go for people disheartened that certain games don't allow co-op. I'm expecting a lot more glitched runs though.

[THC98]

You should just create an extra chart for the Co-op games with this mode. It wouldn't change the normal ranking, because the Co-op rankings would be for entertainment purpose. I think that creating a sub-site would be a big thing to a small thing, in other words, an useless thing. It's not everyone that can play in Co-op. By the way, only a few Sonic games have Co-op modes...

[arcfx1985]

(new here)
Can't co-op just go under Freestyle? (What IS freestyle, anyway?)

[THC98]

(new here)
Can't co-op just go under Freestyle? (What IS freestyle, anyway?)

As far as I know, Freestyle charts are the ones that don't count for the overall ranking, like an optional chart. It would be a good idea to do Co-op charts as Freestyle, like I said before.

[Aitamen]

Would it take issue with the fact that I'd be obtaining them myself, as a proper speedrunner?

[SpinDashMaster]

I would allow such stats.

[SpinDashMaster]

Using any sort of script, however, to control the second player would be definitely illegal.

[Gpro]

Hm... Why not just create a seperate game for S4E2 Co-op(considering it has online Co-op[unless I'm misinformed and it isn't online], placing an exception in the rule). Not that I'm against you guys creating a whole other sub-division of TSC, I'm just curious as to how THAT would work out and such.
Also, I'm curious about what's bad about proposing this, and why Co-op Center would be better suited. Anyone want to gove me a pros/cons list?

[SpinDashMaster]

There doesn't seem to be one yet. 6 "Disapprove" votes and not one post of distaste o_O

[Gpro]

Meh, I'd say that implementing S4E2 Co-op should be a whole new game entirely, allowing two people to gain Site points for the normal part of the site. This would require a small edit in the rules(saying S4E2 Co-op is the ONLY place where Co-op is allowed). ...BUT this should only be if this gets completely shot down and you still want to implement Co-op. The only thing being that you'd have to find out how people can submit stats together. Maybe if you make the stat pend until the person you did it with gets online.... DAMN that sounds complicated >_<

[SpinDashMaster]

Not really. You simply submit your stat if you got it. Both players don't HAVE to submit their stat.

[Parax]

No to having it on TSC because it absolutely should not be a requirement to have a second person to compete.

I don't really like the idea of having a subsite for it either, but whatever, as long as coop stays off the main site. :/

[MrSparkle]

I know this is just for Sonic games, but I'd be all over some Portal 2 co op charts! What about making co-op stats freestyle? A subsite for a few stats in a few games seems really silly.

[SpinDashMaster]

Because Freestyle is a special chart reserved for things that need to be "Freestyled".

[Gpro]

I don't see why anyone would be harshly against it, since it's not a bad idea. I don't really see why anyone would be for it, either(it's completely opinionated, though I'm for it, just because I can XD)

[SpinDashMaster]

because it absolutely should not be a requirement to have a second person to compete.

Not that I'm for putting it on the main site either, but reading helps:

Would it take issue with the fact that I'd be obtaining them myself, as a proper speedrunner?

I would allow such stats.

In tl;dr format, you technically don't need a second player.

[Parax]

You would need a second player if you wanted stats that don't suck.

[SpinDashMaster]

Also for reference, the following games would be included:

Sonic 2
Sonic 3
Sonic & Knuckles
Knuckles Chaotix
Sonic Adventure
Sonic Advance 3
Sonic the Hedgehog (2006)
Sonic Colors
Sonic 4: Episode II

[SpinDashMaster]

You would need a second player if you wanted stats that don't suck.

Says who? SM and Aita do it all the time.

EDIT: in fact, in rings and some score divisions, the pace is so casual that you can take the time to control one guy at a time.

[Groudon]

How about versus mode charts as well?

[SpinDashMaster]

That would add some levels to S2, and include more stuff, say from SA2, Sonic Rush, Sonic Rush Adventure, Sonic and the Secret Rings, and probably others too.

For Versus modes, you may be able to do combined times to account for both players.
There's a lot that opens up with this concept and I encourage further discussion of it to those who are interested.

[Strong Bad]

new co-op chart: s3TA with player 2 waiting on the platform on Chrome Gadget

[SpinDashMaster]

You don't need to do that. You can glitch through the platform.

[Aitamen]

In S4E2, you can play online, which means almost infinite goes with people: no issue there, especially since there's a few TSCers who are willing and able to play as well as the rest of TSC (or be able to learn, we're a generally intellectual bunch).  I know a lot of people have lag and it's not at all a perfect system, but lots of people *could* get use from it that way, if limited to some extent.

In the rest, you'd have to play offline (does/can netplay work over LAN?  I need to go look...), and I'm not specifically sure there's an advantage in all of the levels that have co-op... like in S2, there's no benefit to having Tails in EH1 in any category, I don't believe (maybe score?). 

And while I'm only one person, I learned how to use Tails in S2/S3 for a handful of uses because I wanted to try and copy parts of the TAS.  I can either dual-palm the controllers (A trait I'm not sure how many people have learned...), or in some cases play with my feet (if it's something like one-tap SD or just keeping tailed desynced)

Also, if it's a sub-site you wouldn't be required to play.  It wouldn't have any base effect on TSC except the extra bandwidth (which I don't know that that's a problem, afaik our site runs plenty well).

I mean, I have a 2P (My gf), I have net, and I have the ability to play two characters in some instances, so I certainly stand as someone who could/would have full use of the site.  Which is why I *don't* support it being on the main site: having someone to play with isn't something available to everyone, and it's far harder to get a decent, competent player than, say, to get DLC, and those already warrant separate games.

I don't even know if I'd really compete (I would probably upload my S4E2 stats I have with my gf, if for no other reason than that I have them), but I think having it open would be better, and unless it's a huge load on the site (which I don't know, both not being a networking expert and not knowing the site specifically), I don't see the problem with it, since SDM said "I'll do the charting" and "it won't be hard", from what I've seen.