[X-5]

yeah FR I always have tons of little checkpoints in my head too, they may drive you crazy at times but really they are for the best, its just one of our ways to make sure we're performing up to par for a new record, otherwise why keep playing?

talon, have you ever played the DC version of CE2? You know the 10-ring container on the wall right after the boarding part? On the DC version, its a 20 ring container, which enables for much faster times. Yoshifan did 35.9 on GC(which is very good, my  best was 36.32) so go for 35 GC, 33 if you have a DC.

You seriously don't have to play until insanity, Paragod xD
Who would even be so cruel to make you do that?

I was hoping not.. just thought someone may want me to try for absolute perfection, which I know I cannot do. Determination only goes far.. I'm unable to be determinated for something I feel is beyond my ability!

[finalrush7_]

Very true, Paragod. But I still don't know why I can't just turn them off. <_<
Even when I was recording my 2 rail and all-rail runs of FR, I always had them in my mind. It's not only that, but my brain automatically calculates and tells me how many seconds i'm behind if this was a record run.
BAWWWWWWWWWW

I agree, reching beyond one's limits may be good in some things, but in gaming it is not. Instead, you should just concentrate on other goals. Metal Harbor? Or CG5 (there's 5 seconds of possible cutting according to you)?
I especially like how you were saying for months that you stopped playing seriously, and as soon as I made it possible to go through the key door in PC, you had the record optimized quite well after only a few days. d<_<

[X-5]

haha, honestly I was pretty rusty as I played pyramid cave, compared to when I was at my best. So its not an exceptional record, just a decent one. I watched those 2 runs, the "all rails" in FR was really awesome, from reading the video title I never imagined how challenging that would be until I watched it, and realized how many hard jumps you have to make. Cool, challenging, interesting challenge you accomplished! Whats the max possible time there? :P

My metal harbor is almost perfect, I would play for 1:12 GC but I am pretty sure 1:11 is DC only isn't it? I hate playing on DC. Kinda discourages me, but maybe I can get 1:12 anyway someday. Lots of time can be saved in CG5, 1:54 may be a little insane but at least 1:56 as a reasonable time. You never know what I'll do! just always check the new stats and you may be shocked one day.

but my brain automatically calculates and tells me how many seconds i'm behind if this was a record run.

  Same here, I know exactly what goes through your mind :P it can be tantalizing when you keep ending up slow, and then when you have a run way better than expected you get.........REALLY nervous. Of course.


by the way what does bawwww mean??

[DsSaster]

What is this "nervous" you speak of? *shot*

[Jawzunx]

You know, when your heart-rate speeds up.
It used to happen to me when I was about to beat my EC record every time I got near the capsule.

[Brian]

This is what makes me lose a lot of good runs xD, I know what you're talking about PoT, whenever I play Metal Harbor again I keep looking at the clock, even if I'm only playing for fun, but this don't annoys me, unless I see I'm not playing as good as I've played before.

And talking about perfection, I keep torturing myself for not being able to do most of my record runs without checks :/, I really want to stay playing an entire day, only to be able  to get a check free run in any stages I play for real.

[finalrush7_]

Thanks, I'm glad you liked my special FR runs ^_^
I watched my allrails run again, and maybe even the mission 4 limit of 5 minutes can be broken? I'm not sure, but I'll give it a try this weekend (pretty busy week <_<).

I wouldn't know why 1:11 would be DC-only. I just watched it and I didn't see anything like that..!? If it really is DC-only, then that's too bad. But if it isn't....you could try to take the record back. That will be difficult though, the 1:11 run has only very small flaws.

Same here, I know exactly what goes through your mind :P it can be tantalizing when you keep ending up slow, and then when you have a run way better than expected you get.........REALLY nervous. Of course.

Yeah, but what sucks is that it's pretty much impossible (at least for me) to do better than what I had in my record run, so equalizing it is the only thing I can do <_<


I still have big plans for SA2, but the busy days make me push my ambitions for the game further and further away. <_<

[X-5]

I wouldn't know why 1:11 would be DC-only. I just watched it and I didn't see anything like that..!? If it really is DC-only, then that's too bad. But if it isn't....you could try to take the record back. That will be difficult though, the 1:11 run has only very small flaws.

watch his old 1:12.35 run. He gets to the last check at 40.0, and on my 1:13.67 run I got to that check at 40.5. He was exactly 0.1 sec slower than me jumping to the rocket. So at this point, his run should be 0.4 sec faster than mine. He did the boarding no better than me, and his jump to the goal ring was about the same, maybe even a little slower since it wasn't so smooth compared to mine. So He should only be 0.4 or even 0.3 faster than me.. thats about 1:13.37....where did a WHOLE second come from? (1.02) To me it looks like you start boarding faster on DC, that's the only explanation I can come up with. It seems to only happen on DC so DC has a 1 sec advantage :(

That kinda discourages me like I said, I know GC can probably do a low 1:12 with all the new gravity tricks Brian helped him find, but I can never get the record which makes me say screw it, my 1:13 was perfect for its time anyway! Maybe someday though i'll torture myself and play on DC.

I watched my allrails run again, and maybe even the mission 4 limit of 5 minutes can be broken? I'm not sure, but I'll give it a try this weekend (pretty busy week <_<).

you don't have to seriously speedrun them, I was just playing around :P

I can't wait to see what surprises you have for SA2..!

Yeah, but what sucks is that it's pretty much impossible (at least for me) to do better than what I had in my record run, so equalizing it is the only thing I can do <_<

yeah I know. For me though, sometimes I have an insane run that is waaaaay better than anything I've ever had in my life, and I really start to worry. In fact, my 1:36 CE was one of those runs, because I had crossed the fence at 54(usually 55) and landed from the building at 1:06.. man I started to get so nervous here... I go for the pit jump...easy...I go for the spindash jump/rail bounce by the robot..(I MADE IT!!) then I think... there's no way i'll roll under the cage to start the truck chase without flying in the air..sure enough I did. At this point it was feeling so intense I probably had the power to kick a door down without even trying..you can't see it in the movie, but I was SOOOOOO nervous doing the spindashes at each hill, hoping to god I don't mess them up, which is easy to do. I nailed the first 2 hills...lined up with the yellow line in the middle..yes!! JUST ONE MORE HILL! I nailed the final hill and i'm like.. DO NOT accidentally get stuck on the side of the road while lining up the goal ring!!!!! DON'T!!!!!(easy to do w/o practice) and I didn't........NAILED THE GOAL RING! INSANE RUN AND NO CHECKS! that's why I jumped from 1:38.10 to 1:36.89, it was just so perfect. I almost died of excitement, and I knew I would never top this :)

[finalrush7_]

I am shocked to reveal that you in fact start the boarding ~1.2 seconds faster on DC than on GC. That sucks!! I just did a slo-mo of both runs next to each other...and..yeah <_<
I really wish it were otherwise, and that no console would have an advantage. I'm sorry you can't get into this record now, Paragod..

I know, but speedrunning them would be a nice challenge. I'm currently looking for a few challenges, be it Final Rush or another stage.

I've been thinking about seriously (like, really seriously) starting to play CE to see if I can join the group of the top5, or maybe even sub1:45 some day. In my 1:49 run I had to abuse the first check (0.3 seconds lost), I got stuck on the fence in midair (lost 0.4) and I got shot off the last hill (damn that last hill in the truck chase, I always fail there) (lost 1 second?)
I know there's still lots of room to improve on CE, and I can even get a consistent 0:37 check (awesome for me), but Idk how much I want to spend on that.
However I promised you a sub1:47 at least and that will be done soon.

I know what you mean when you say dying of excitement, imagine how I felt when you had a 2:11:70 and I got a 2:11:64!!! Not to mention when I broke the 2:10 barrier! That was really awesome!! Getting the Final Chase record was cool, too, but nowhere near as great...


Maybe I'm a bit slow, but I just noticed Brian's 'Mr. Shortcut' nickname. I definitely like it, and it matches all his patents in his sig ^_^

[Brian]

I really hate to lose good runs because of this feeling that take control of me :/, all of my sub 25 runs in GH were lost because of this, hahahahahahha if you see my 25:39 video you'll see what I'm talking about, I missed a stupid homing attack there, another example was my RH M5 run, when I'm about to reach the goal ring, I was shaking so much, and that made me miss the "A" button twice, then shadow did that single jump instead of a homing attack xD

Yeah when I first noticed the record in the index I was like: OMG!!! Someone did it, with video! When I watched the video I though: Most of the difference is on the boarding. Then Son1cGu1tar did it again, and another second was saved, but again due to a new amazing time saver. I'm sure his record is beatable(not for me, I can't play this stage past the mid check :P), 'cause in both runs he was really slow in different parts, in the first run his was slow after the mid check(mostly after the second loop, after the spindash jump), and in his second run, he was slow until he reached the mid check. And another thing comes on my mind, I really hated what happened to a guy, who got your record in February, he got 1:12:80 using basically the same strategy you used in your run, and playing in GC! And no one knew about it, 'cause Son1cGu1tar got your record. I've pasted the link to his video in that topic about TSC translations months ago, I really think he deserve some congratulations. That's why I think you can beat his record, even playing in GC, of course it would be very hard, but it's possible even with the 1 sec advantage :D

PoT I think you lose so much more than 1 second when you fly in the truck part of CE, I think it's something around 3 or more seconds, 'cause while you are in the air and slow, you could be in the street rolling at a very high speed, I'm sure it makes you lose a BIG amount of time, more than most of the tricks in this game :P. LOL do you liked my nickname? Yeah, I though about it due to my sig(what made me remember of naming some tricks I haven't put there), and my personal text was based on my Total Mission 3 ranking :D

Edit: I forgot to mention... if that guy have used Son1cGu1tar's tricks, that run could be a  low 1:10 or high 1:09 for sure(In DC of course)

[Talon]

I hate that feeling. That happened to me a few times on different levels of the game and on S1 as well. Once my hands got so sweaty that i dropped the controller (fail)

So i've been playing around on FR1 for an hour and got 2:32 (YAY!!!). Which i shall improve on, but i'm on to getting sub 1:40 on CE1 now. I can't seem to avoid the speed pads at the truck part, maybe Brian if you can make a video or something.

[X-5]

I am shocked to reveal that you in fact start the boarding ~1.2 seconds faster on DC than on GC. That sucks!!

So it really is true. Wow! I had a feeling it was, but I was not 100% sure.  Brian, yeah I did see the 1:12.80 GC run, it was pretty nice. I don't know why I never found it sooner though..plus the guy never submitted it. I can definitely see 1:10 like you said, but 1:09?? That would be just flat out crazy, that's 4 seconds faster than my "perfect" run and 7 seconds better than the old 1:16 which stood for a long time! If I ever get used to playing on DC(It sucks!)I may get 1:10, but I won't promise anything as of now.


On CE, trust me man you once you play enough to start being really consistent you'll  easily get sub 1:45. Think of how hard Brian will have to play to get his sub 1:40..you can atleast take it under '45 ;) About bouncing the last hill..like Brian said definitely more than a second. anywhere from 2-4.. I don't know exactly, the last hill is the easiest of them all, because the ramp lets you know when to get ready.

I know what you mean when you say dying of excitement, imagine how I felt when you had a 2:11:70 and I got a 2:11:64!!! Not to mention when I broke the 2:10 barrier! That was really awesome!! Getting the Final Chase record was cool, too, but nowhere near as great...

Even more excited than when you beat my 2:07? I know 2:11 was the first time you beat me, but beating 2:07 was just flat out crazy! Sub 2:10 was a cool barrier to break too though!

[Talon]

So pretty much fail at getting sub 1 40 on CE1 with my best today being 1 47 02. A reasonable time, but i need it to get better than this. The truck chase really screwed me over. I managed 1 23 at the last checkpoint and then missed the first hill by somersaulting in the middle. I thought that i should also go for CE5's second place seeing as it is 1 55 and paragod's record isn't even touched.

FR1 seems to be difficult for me to break 2:20. Maybe after CE1 i'll give it a shot. I can't even imagine of breaking the barrier of 2:10. How you guys managed that is beyond me.

MH1 i never really properly did a proper speed run on. I played it for a day's practice, was happy with my 1:20 and then stopped.

The loop trick on CE3 is giving me a headache. I only get it when i'm practising. Is there any way of getting 90-100% sure?

[X-5]

heh yeah the record gap on CE5 is crazy, I have a 13 second lead, yet the level is, at least, 3 seconds from being perfect. CE1 is only about a second off of pixel-perfection yet the gap is only 8 seconds, well I guess 5 really since Brian has 1:41 now...shows how nobody cares about M5's.

1:23 on the last check is a potential 1:42, it's 19 seconds from check to goal if you do the chase as well as I do. 20 or 21 seconds if you die and restart from that check though, so the potential drops to about 1:44 if you can't do it all in 1 run.

I can't even imagine of breaking the barrier of 2:10. How you guys managed that is beyond me.

Looking back, it is beyond me too... but we did it! We were just crazy, whilst enjoying our competition :P

[finalrush7_]

Well, if I really lost more than just a second on that wasted hill, then that means I only have a bigger chance at sub1:45ing CE1. It's also cool that I'm pretty consistent in that "go under the left side of the fence to not be sent flying form the very first hill"-trick :D

I never really had a chance to play a DC game or hold its controller, so why does it suck so much? <_<
And it's really pissing me off that in the console comparison, GC's losing badly...

Yeah, I wish them both good luck at getting sub1:40 in CE! I can't possibly imagine myself doing something that crazy, but if I even manage a sub1:45, I'll be more than happy. After all, City Escape was my first Sonic level ever!

Man, beating your 2:07 was awesome as well, but it lacked something.. I think it was that I knew you were done with this level, and once I beat it out competition was over. I don't know why, but once I seriously started going for the record when your time was 2:07, I somehow lost the hope of finding even more cuts.
It was all just a procedure of doing a pretty much perfect run. I remember that countless time I went into the level with 99 lives just to practice the part from 0:44-1:20, because that was my weakest part...
Little did I know that 2:07 was even possible when I frst got my 2:09. Having gotten that time with 2 checks, I completely believed that my run was perfect aside from the checks, only to come back a few weeks later and to see you beating it by over 2 seconds.

It's pretty hard to explain how exactly sub2:10 can be gotten..I think it's something like when you see a top-speedrun. You're doing the same things he does, but you still can't get the same time. It's the very small errors you can only see and avoid when you've played a level for a very long time.

[X-5]

Yup, time gained from very small optimizations that come naturally from playing the level hundreds of times really adds up. For example a tenth of a second doing this or that probably won't be noticed, but if there's 20 spots of it in the level, there's 2 seconds you can't see. Plus as none of us will ever be perfect every run will have variations. My 2:07 felt perfect, but I know I lost a few tiny bits of times that I can't even see, and FR was faster in some spots to beat me by a third. That's why 2:06 is possible, but it's almost down to luck to get that time, unless you somehow have robotic skills.

It's also cool that I'm pretty consistent in that "go under the left side of the fence to not be sent flying form the very first hill"-trick :D

Cool, that is a good trick to be able to pull off well. I was pretty proud of it when I found it, but man it's really hard to do w/o using the last checkpoint. I believe you can do it from the right side too, but obviously that's way harder and it wastes time.


I was done at 2:07, but that doesn't mean you should have stopped looking for new tricks..remember, my comment said I am only done if no new fairly big time savers are found! If you found something that saves a second or more, I'd of came back :P

[Brian]

Paragod, I'm sure it's possible to get a high 1:09 in DC, but you'll need to adapt yourself to the DC joystick again, what's very boring to do, but I don't think it sucks, it's a very good controller, it gives you a lot of precision, so much more than the GC controller IMO, 'cause the GC's one have an octagonal shape, which makes go in straight line easier, but the DC's one have a circular shape, and this gives you more precision to change your direction or make turns.

Final Rush is one of the stages I have more problems to get everything right in one run, it took a while to get my 2:13, and I don't see myself getting something like this without a lot of pratice, I really really really hate that rail shortcut at 29 seconds, that's what make me don't play it so much :/

Yeah, while you keep training, you'll start to get the tricks to work, and eventually get sub 1:45. And about the loop trick in M3, there's a way to do it properly: when you reach the loop you just need to do a homing attack at that spot shown in the videos, but here's the knack, instead of push the control stick to the corner, you need to aim to the corner and release the control stick, this way sonic will push himself through the loop :), that's how I do and it never failed. Talking about M5, it was a real surprise to see myself in the 2nd place, 'cause I got that time while playing just to get to the red section, and when I submitted it, what?! 2nd place? o.O. I never touched it since this day :P. Oh, I almost forgot... I'll try to tape that turn trick on the truck part for you guys, and I finally can record the sound. I'll maybe do it this Sunday, I'll finally have a break from my job, so I'll tape it in the morning and in the evening I'll go to the Video Games Live Show!!! Woorray :D

[Talon]

thanks brian. I've managed to cut my FR1 time down to 2:19 with no checkpoint abuse. I havent had time to do my CE5 run yet.

Hmm, i'll try CE1 again. I think i could get a sub 1:10 if i try really really hard, but before i never got the trick to work so my best is 1:36 which took me hours to do.

FR1 can get a bit annoying i'll point out the most annoying bits and see if there's any bits that you can help me with. At around 11-12. the spindash onto the rail is annoying since i usually miss it. The jump at around 29-30 seconds (As Brian pointed out) Is also annoying as well. The part at around 1:00 to make the jump from the first rail (Above the ring box and spring) and the second rail gets on my nerves as it messes up the run. The jump at around 1:11 - 1:12 to get to the platform with the artifical enemy i cant seem to do without a million tries. Near the end when you have to jump from the platform with the line of rings onto the rail, i always light dash even though i'm on the right. And at the last chase part, i can't get a smooth landing at the beginning. These are the main things that trouble me.

I shall try CE1 and hope to get sub 1:40 by the end of october. If not, i'll just try final rush until i break sub 2:10

[X-5]

Brian, thanks for that explanation of the loop trick! I could only ever to get it to work on DC, and since I sucked at DC I could only get 1:09.. maybe I can get a great record on CE3 now, 1:07 or maybe even 1:06!

*plays CE3*

[finalrush7_]

At around 11-12. the spindash onto the rail is annoying since i usually miss it.

I never had trouble doing that. Is the camera causing you to miss it?

The jump at around 29-30 seconds

As soon as the rails start to curve to the left for the last time, press A (keep holding the joystick to the right), and then about 0.4-0.5 seconds after youv'e pressed A, press B. I can get it done 30% of the time with that.

The part at around 1:00 to make the jump from the first rail (Above the ring box and spring) and the second rail gets on my nerves as it messes up the run

I'm not exactly sure what's troubling you here, but most importantly you have to make sure that you have enough speed, or you won't make it.

The jump at around 1:11 - 1:12 to get to the platform with the artifical enemy i cant seem to do without a million tries

Well, that is really difficult and requires a lot of practice (and a bit of luck) :P

Near the end when you have to jump from the platform with the line of rings onto the rail, i always light dash even though i'm on the right

You can light dash the chain of rings. Doing so will make this part much easier for you, and you'll only lose about a quarter of a second.

And at the last chase part, i can't get a smooth landing at the beginning.

This comes from practice. Doing that part a lot of time will give you the feeling to know exactly when to release your bounce. And once you have that feeling, it won't go away. (I can do the smooth lading 100%)


I would of told you to not use some of these advanced tricks because their success rate is quite low, but if you're going for sub2:10, you will have no choice...


Side note: I haven't been able to do that loop trick in any mission in CE yet. Even with Brian's explanation... Damn, I sure suck. >_<

[Talon]

thanks PoT. I shall try some of these and hope to sub 2:10. My best time right now is 2 19 which is pretty average for me. I know i could go lower but i'll try to focus on CE first

Thanks brian for the loop trick, now i can probably get the CE3 record before paragod (Yeah right). Or at least sub 1:10.

I was playing a bit of MH yesterday and found out how shit i am at it. I can barely even beat my old time of 1:20. I found a trick that is around a second slower than the rocket superbounce but is a LOT easier to pull off. I usually hit the spring at around 11-11:50. I get the 2nd checkpoint at 22, but get the last one at 44-45.

So, I managed a 1:11:65. this seems pretty bad, but i got a 37.8 checkpoint which i thought was crap. Looks like the loop trick worked, thanks brian. I shall try to sub 1:09 before paragod.

[X-5]

I'll do my best to prevent you from taking my CE sweep!

What do you feel is your maximum potential for the mission? Mine is definitely 1:06 if I can tie my best first check time, which is 35.8.

As for the trick... I got it to work twice during practice without too much trouble, but then when I play for a record run of course it never works :( Hopefully soon...because 1:09 sucks so much!!

[Talon]

1:06 holy crap. I think my complete and utter best would be a high 1:07 or low 1:08. But that's with no mistakes throughout the whole run. My best 1st checkpoint time is around 36.3 which isn't too good, but i don't use the rails at the stair parts, I use the stairs and can always manage a high 36 with no mistakes.

The trick works for me most times. It's just sometimes i jump too late and the loop pushes me back so i can't homing attack on the spot.

I feel the same way. So even if i make a few mistakes i keep going because sometimes it works. I shall try to sub 1:09 before you get back to your peek and completely own CE3

[Brian]

No problem talon :), as I can see the competition has begun, so let's see who'll be the first of you to get sub 1:09, I don't think I'll be able to do so, but I'll give it a try whenever I can.

And PoT, I'm sure you just need some pratice to get this trick to work, I'll tape a partial run to show you exactly what I do, and to show how to do the turn trick at the truck part.

[Talon]

ahhh, So far i have done no better than my 1:11. The most annoying thing was, i had around 1:09 XX. and i missed the chao (Secretly cries).

So after failing for a an hour I MISSED THE FUCKING CHAO AGAIN, and ended up with 1:11:25. I shall try again for 2moz. How's urs coming along paragod

[Brian]

Oh... so you've done it Para :D, got any video? It's a great time, now you'll have a tough record to beat talon :)

Edit: Great time on M5! I really didn't saw that coming so fast :D

[Talon]

Ahhh man. 1:08 without even landing on the chao, yeah im pretty much screwed unless i practice all day 2day. Right now i'll aim to beat you but if i can't, 2nd is good enough.

I was going to do a PC1 run, but i can't get the glitch to work, so i'll probably just do a clean run and aim to sub 2 minutes

[finalrush7_]

I'm gone for like 2 days and I only come back to see some heavy improvement in City Escape!!

Awesome times Paragod, even if they're not that perfect for you. I remember you saying 1:39 on CE5 would be as perfect as 1:36 on CE1, so if that still counts, you're pretty close!!

I played the game yesterday and I noticed I improved quite a bit. I got a 1:49:xx with a nice run and being sent off flying off 2 hills at the truck chase. Yeah, I can definitely smell a 1:45!!

[Werey]

I really dont see how you can do it much faster than me. I copy EXACTLY what you do and im still getting 2:08 lol.

[Talon]

So i had a go at CE1 again and the first time i tried i got 1:44 :). The only thing was that it is 1:44:52 which is not good enough to beat jawzun. 0.03 seconds slower. I got a 1:25 checkpoint at the end and had an awesome truck chase.

I still can't figure out how to get past the speed panels before the truck chase. When will the video be ready Brian cause i would really like to know

I shall try my PC1 time to be one of the fastest without the door glitch since i still can't get through it.