[Magnezone]

Well excuse my lack of SA2 knowledge :[

And yeah, the Red Gem does slow everything, except Sonic, including the timer down. Test it yourself and see how fast you can get to a checkpoint without it, and then with it.

[KnucklesSonic8]

Bouncing up and down just isn't the same as blasting yourself 400 feet in the air at will.

Can you say "superbounce"?

Also I could've sworn that the red gem didnt slow the timer down, just everything else+Sonic but eh ;x

The video I sourced, the guy said "it doesn't slow down the clock, though" and, yeah, he did say it slows everything else down except the timer apparently. Maybe he was wrong I guess? For the Red gem, wouldn't this affect Boss competitions as well since they can be slowed down as well apparently, according to, again the sourc'd video.


Regarding the gems, my personal opinion is that some are banned and some are permitted. F-Man brings a good point that they must've had competition in mind when they created these gems and it would bring a non-traditional competition to the site, however, some of the gems are just too "cheap", for lack of a better word, that it may take the whole point out of some select competitions. We need to consider all factors, and this won't be an easy decision, necessarily.

Don't forget too, the fact that gems can be combined! This could alter your thoughts on the matter a bit, depending on what you think of the idea of having the gems in the first place.

The most notable ones are:

Blue Gem - should be allowed; a simple item that increases your speed - kinda like other power-ups in previous games; not a big problem

Red Gem - see above; I don't think it should be allowed.

Purple Gem - definitely debatable; I don't think it should be allowed; personally - infinte jumps, yeah, as was mentioned, it does sound like a Gameshark code.

Sky Blue Gem - not sure about this one; could people potentially get better times with this? it depends on how far you're able to throw it. I don't think, though, it'll make much of a difference considering the speed you go in most of the stages but this could affect Silver's gameplay I guess since they're more slow-paced (out of the three, anyways); I'm against it I think, now.

Yellow Gem - definitely must take into account; I don't know what to say on this:
I could say we should allow it because it can give everyone a fair chance of collecting all rings w/o worrying about enemies; I could say no because it restricts how much competition can be done since you'll never get attacked and it decreases the level of skill involved. It's very debatable. I think I'll say... meh.. I'll leave it as undecided for now until I see what you guys think of it.

I'll have to keep track of who's in favor for each of the aforementioned. I'll see your position on the matter, depending on your posts.

Let's see what everyone thinks of this gem debate....:

SELECT GEMS:
Blue Gem
ALLOW: knuckles_sonic8, SkyLights (2)
RESTRICT:

Red Gem
ALLOW:
RESTRICT: ks8

Purple Gem
ALLOW:
RESTRICT: magnum12, ks8 (2)

Sky Blue Gem
ALLOW:
RESTRICT: magnum12, ks8 (2)

Yellow Gem
ALLOW:
RESTRICT:

ALL GEMS:
ALLOW: F-Man
RESTRICT:

[magnum12]

Here's my stance on the gems. I believe gems only affects Sonic's stages though. How can gems be combined? I'd like to see an example of that.
-Green: Allow.
-Blue: Allow. It does take some skill to prevent yourself from smaking a wall or falling off a pit.
-Red: Depends on if it can be combined really well with the blue gem. If so, I'd say no.
-Sky Blue: No way, especially in vertical stages.
-Purple: No way. Competition in stages such as White Acropolis, Kingdom Valley, Flame Core, and Aquatic Base would be really screwed up by this gem.
-Yellow: Yes in action stages since you can't use gems in Mach Speed sections, so you have to protect yourself in those sections. No for boss battles though since the yellow gem (due to the gauge glitch I discussed earlier) would make Sonic effectively immortal (i.e effect equivilant to a game shark code), taking the skill out of score and ring attacks during boss battles.

[KnucklesSonic8]

Here's my stance on the gems. I believe gems only affects Sonic's stages though. How can gems be combined? I'd like to see an example of that.
-Green: Allow.
-Blue: Allow. It does take some skill to prevent yourself from smaking a wall or falling off a pit.
-Red: Depends on if it can be combined really well with the blue gem. If so, I'd say no.
-Sky Blue: No way, especially in vertical stages.
-Purple: No way. Competition in stages such as White Acropolis, Kingdom Valley, Flame Core, and Aquatic Base would be really screwed up by this gem.
-Yellow: Yes in action stages since you can't use gems in Mach Speed sections, so you have to protect yourself in those sections. No for boss battles though since the yellow gem (due to the gauge glitch I discussed earlier) would make Sonic effectively immortal (i.e effect equivilant to a game shark code), taking the skill out of score and ring attacks during boss battles.

Check the video I sourced on the previous page (depends on how many posts per page I guess but my lengthy post after the site came back) for an example of that. It's at/near the end of the movie. He combined Yellow and Purple I believe (I think I remember that correctly but don't take my word for it). He said that others can be combined as well.

Thanks for your opinion. Forgot about Green Gem since I assumed it was a given (doesn't affect anything, really). I also decided on the Yellow Gem as well.

SELECT GEMS:
Blue Gem
ALLOW: knuckles_sonic8, SkyLights, magnum12 (3)
RESTRICT:

Red Gem
ALLOW:
RESTRICT: ks8

Purple Gem
ALLOW:
RESTRICT: magnum12, ks8 (2)

Sky Blue Gem
ALLOW:
RESTRICT: magnum12, ks8 (2)

Yellow Gem
ALLOW: magnum12 (Action Stages); ks8 (Action Stages) (2)
RESTRICT:
Green Gem
ALLOW: ks8, magnum12 (2)
RESTRICT:

ALL GEMS:
ALLOW: F-Man
RESTRICT:

[F-Man]

You people are ridiculous.

All gems are allowed. Period.

Screw that stupid allowed gems list.

kthx

[Bilan]

Well for one, only Sonic gets to use them so considering if Silver could abuse them is completely irrelevant.

And yeah, I completely agree with effy. Right down to the ridiculous part.

[magnum12]

We should wait for a final decision by Rolken and SM. I'll summarize the arguments from both sides for that purpose.
-Arguments for restricting gems: Deciding on which gems should be allowed should be done on a case by case basis. If it weren't for Sonic's custom gauge not working properly (i.e. does not decrease when a gem power is used) all of the gems would be fine for use in competition. The purple gem should not be allowed because the busted gauge allows for infinite jumps, something you would expect to see from a game shark code (moon jump codes as they are called). This gem would have its worst effects in Kingdom Valley, Flame Core, and Aquatic Base. The Yellow Gem should not be allowed in boss fights since the busted gauge allows the player to always have a blue shield like ability on. This would cause Sonic to be effectively immortal during boss battles (like a game shark invincibity code), removing any skill in boss battle ring competitions. The blue gem is fine since that takes skill to avoid something bad happening to you while using it.
-Arguments against restricting gems: Gems were intended with competition in mind. (Point agreed upon by both sides.) Could result in interesting competition if used correctly. Only Sonic can use them.

[KnucklesSonic8]

Better idea, magnum, thanks. I also think we should wait on Rolken and SM for their opinion. I'll be sure (or whomever if it's not me for w/e reason) to address it to their attention.

[Magnezone]

As it stands, if we're going to allow any of them, we might as well just allow all of them. Plus, the times we've been getting for early competition use the gems. They're cheap, but hey, it's only a piece of the game anyway. There's still all the other characters to play around with in levels.

[KnucklesSonic8]

SL brings up a good point but it's still Rolko and SM that have the final say. We should return to this later, I think, and address any other issues regarding the idea of having a competition, then, address this issue. Anyone else up for it?

What other issues have left to be resolved? Actually, I just looked back and it looks like that Amigo Characters and Super Forms are the only things remaining but I think these were considered to be false so most likely will not be added. So... does this mean all we have left to do now is finalize division sectors, and, oh yeah, establish rules, if necessary.

Information regarding Rivals is also progressing well. We may be able to present both simultaneously, in one shot, which would be good.

This is so much easier if it's a newer game; speaking from experience, now. ;) Hopefully, Secret Rings will be as simple and straight-forward as both this and Rivals was/is.

[Bilan]

Effy already drew up two potential brackets listing all stats, and as far as I can see, '06 needs no additional rules, aside from "You must use TA mode" which is pretty much common knowledge anyway.

[F-Man]

Let us still wait for the PS3 version.

[Bilan]

Boo hiss.

EDIT: On a serious note what possible differences could there be?

[F-Man]

Boo hiss.

EDIT: On a serious note what possible differences could there be?

They could change the way missions start so there is only one loading screen, and the timer would start while you receive the mission, making them longer. Might be a bit far fetched, but you never know.

It's also entirely possible that they fix the infinite jumps with the purple gem (although I'm starting to think they wouldn't cause that's really its ONLY USE...). If they do, I'd be tempted to just say "Well, let's just take the version that has an advantage", but downloadable content is suspected to arrive near the launch of the PS3 version (since they delayed it for that reason), so they could also fix it for the 360 version via a patch, making the bug is present : bug isn't present ratio at 1/3.

Those are just two examples, you can probably find more if you use your imagination. Basically, while SH and Riders were obviously going to be the same on all platforms, I believe it is less likely to be the case this time (but still highly probable).

[Bilan]

Personally I think they'll be the same but meh

[KnucklesSonic8]

I was wondering that myself, thanks F-Man for just explaining. That's a good reason, I guess, to hold off; y'know, just to be sure.... and besides, we can wait a while..Rivals has things still needed to be sorted out, then we can, as I said, tell Rolko all in one shot.

On that note, F-Man, you never told me why you're getting both?

When I do, though, should I PM 'im or...?

[Bilan]

WAIT? WHAT IS THIS CONCEPT OF WAIT!? I WANT TO SUBMIT RITE NAOW.

Er yeah.

Anyway, Rolk'll likely add it if we bug him enough in chat X)

[magnum12]

Boo hiss.

EDIT: On a serious note what possible differences could there be?

They could change the way missions start so there is only one loading screen, and the timer would start while you receive the mission, making them longer. Might be a bit far fetched, but you never know.

It's also entirely possible that they fix the infinite jumps with the purple gem (although I'm starting to think they wouldn't cause that's really its ONLY USE...). If they do, I'd be tempted to just say "Well, let's just take the version that has an advantage", but downloadable content is suspected to arrive near the launch of the PS3 version (since they delayed it for that reason), so they could also fix it for the 360 version via a patch, making the bug is present : bug isn't present ratio at 1/3.

Those are just two examples, you can probably find more if you use your imagination. Basically, while SH and Riders were obviously going to be the same on all platforms, I believe it is less likely to be the case this time (but still highly probable).

I hope a patch is coming soon. If it turns out that the PS3 version winds up being better than the 360 version, has a bunch of extra content, and no patch is released for the 360 version, I'm going to be one mad gamer. To be honest, most of this game's problems could be fixed with a good patch. Here's the stuff I'd like to see in a patch (if that ever happens).
1. The whole Night of Kronos thing that was promised but never happened.
2. Fix the issues with Knuckles and Rouge when trying to jump off a wall (sometimes they won't jump off the wall no matter how many times you jump).
3. Add a radar to Rouge's section of Kingdom Valley.  I hated that section. It was worse than some of the garbage hunting levels in SA2.
4. Fix the custom gauge bug. Note to detractors of my rule proposal; this would make my arguments for restricting certain gems null and void.
5. Allow Sonic to change direction while jumping in mach speed sections. This is to make the mach speed sections more like part 2 of Speed Highway (Sonic). It would also reduce a lot of complaints I read about regarding mach speed sections having awful controls.
6. Fix the snow boarding sections.
7. Increase Sonic's acceleration and traction. Reason: acceleration is a common complaint in this game and increased traction could partially deal with sensitive control issues.
8. Slightly increase Shadow's top speed.
9. Slight to moderate increase in Silver's top speed to reduce complaints about glacial pacing.
10. Increase Amy's top speed. Her speed is a major step backwards, even compared to SA.
11. Camera fixes if possible.
12. Load times. Need I say enough.

[Bilan]

WHAT.

You mean that achievment does absolutely nothing? (Nights of Kronus)

Just reply yes or no to that, I dont want specifics D:

[magnum12]

Yes. People have tried getting all S ranks AND getting every silver medal. Nothing dood. *runs before RPG gets an idea from master Etna and comes up with some horrible new ally murder.*

[KnucklesSonic8]

It's true, RPG. Same goes for Amigo Characters I believe.

[F-Man]

Achievement don't do anything, you must do something to get them. In this case, you need to complete the "secret" ending with ranks S, and some people assumed that this ending would be another one because the achievements requirements are poorly translated.

[Bilan]

So how does one beat this "secret ending" with rank S?

And also, I found the ending to be really dumb and gay, it was the only part of the whole story I didnt like :X

[Shadow Jacky]

man this place has been busy.  read and caught up and glad to hear some nice things about Sonic 06.  also another good thing is the downloadable content which I hope sega/sonic team takes to good use to fix waht they can. 

[KnucklesSonic8]

So how does one beat this "secret ending" with rank S?

And also, I found the ending to be really dumb and gay, it was the only part of the whole story I didnt like :X

I could imagine. I only liked the part right before the EOTW stage. I didn't like the scene after but I liked the second last scene of the game - it was just, as oyu said, the final scene that got to me.

By that, I think he means getting an S Rank on both End of the World and Solaris. Otherwise, I wouldn't know but I do know that they're hard to pull off. On that note, has anyone seen a video of someone playing through End of the World? I wanna see the stage so badly :P Anyone find anything off the top of their heads?

[Bilan]

Solaris was absolute cake to S Rank.

EOTW is a complete pain in the ass though. Just to beat.

[KnucklesSonic8]

Solaris was absolute cake to S Rank.

EOTW is a complete pain in the ass though. Just to beat.

Again, I could only imagine... And here I thought Solaris would be harder... :P

It's too bad, though, that the Amigos thing was only a rumor, unfortauntely. I would've been happy if I tried the game one day off of my friend's 360 if I could play as them.

[F-Man]

EDIT: OH YEAH, almost forgot, 2 of Silver's missions (that I marked with ???) have powerup item boxes that give you extra points, so maybe we should score them. However, they're really only there to help you make it to the end (they're directly in your way) meaning that just about everyone get all of them through a normal run anyway, so maybe they shouldn't be counted.

Just did a quick tests on both missions, and it turns out the powerup boxes are just as required to get as the rings themselves. So that settles the question, no score attack is necessary for these.

[KnucklesSonic8]

So I guess you can edit your charts now with the new info on those.

[F-Man]

In other words, guess what I got today :D!